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Sometimes I wonder why I wanted to bring children into this world at all, and what kind of world we'll be leaving behind for them.
Posts: 4325 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote: Sometimes I wonder why I wanted to bring children into this world at all,
Do you regret having been born, because of the evils you see before you? I think not. Neither will your children regret their own birth. We must all pass through sorrow that we may know joy.
Posts: 305 | Registered: Apr 2009
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Thank you, kazbert. That part isn't always easy to remember.
Still, I look at my sweet little son sleeping in my lap and I feel sick at what he'll have to face. What he'll have to avoid. What he'll have to fight against. I just hope we do right by him and equip him well enough.
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quote: This new "Fifty Shades of Gray" phenomenon is just one of the latest examples of how that's happening. One of the reasons the book became so popular is because it was first available on the Kindle, so woman could read it without others being able so see the cover.
I was really bothered by a website that allowed you to print alternate covers for Fifty Shades. One of the covers was even a bible devotional. Unfortunately all of the women I saw on my message board commenting on the blog loved the idea or thought it was funny.
Posts: 4947 | Registered: Sep 2002
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I know quite a few women (non LDS) who have read the Gray books, and gone to see the Magic Mike movie. It really worries me to see so many caught up in it all. There may be a lot of LDS women reading the book as well, but they won't say so. I know I don't want to read it, but knowing so many who have, it has been very difficult to put it out of my mind. I love to read, but I didn't know how tempting it would be for me to read this book because I know so many others who have. I'll have to really guard myself with this kind of stuff.
Posts: 2712 | Registered: Feb 2000
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Sparky, would it help at all to know that the book is widely panned in book reviews? It started out at Twilight fan fiction for those who wished Twilight was steamier.
There's a plot summary over at moviespoiler.com, and it sounds kind of ridiculous. Most book reviews that panned it have at least one person in the comments who defends it, and they invariably start out with, "I normally don't read, but I love this....."
Posts: 1901 | Registered: Mar 2007
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quote: This new "Fifty Shades of Gray" phenomenon is just one of the latest examples of how that's happening. One of the reasons the book became so popular is because it was first available on the Kindle, so woman could read it without others being able so see the cover.
I disagree. Women have been reading steamy books for years and they haven't cared what the covers revealed about their reading choices. The 'romance' genre was pretty steamy 30 years ago - it is probably much more explicit now. My understanding is that genre is one of the best selling. Women probably first read this series on kindle because it was cheap - others probably read it because it was highly reviewed or word of mouth.
It does not surprise me that many LDS women are reading the series. In many ways, we are following the same trends as society at large, just a few years behind. No doubt if these particular readers were questioned on this choice, they'd have a good rationale - they read it for the articles. Oh wait. That was playboy.
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I agree that women have been reading steamy books for years and years. What gets me is that the women who have talked to me about the book have all said that the books have gone much further and are much, much more explicit than many of the romance books were, as well as being masochistic in its approach to "romance." These are women who I would have never expected to read these types of books but have because they are popular, even though they know how panned they have been by reviewers. And what gets me even more is these women consider themselves to be good Christian women, yet they are getting pulled into this trash. I know its trash, both literature-wise (writing-wise) and topic-wise. Yet even still I had to spend several days talking to myself about how corrupt it is and how undesireable it is after these women told me about reading them. I never expected that I'd have to reiterate to myself my own standards in such a very specific "talking-to-myself" kind of way for several days to get past the draw of the books. I was very surprised at my response to it all. I worry for those women who don't have the stamina or resources or whatever to resist the draw that these types of things can have on them.
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I also see a distinction between this and steamy romance novels, although it may just be in terms of degree. This is classified as erotica, and it's about a man introducing a woman to the BDSM scene.
A second sentiment I noticed in a lot of the reviews I read was from people who regularly read erotica who felt that although this was a poorly written book, they saw it as a gateway to reading other books of erotica, and encouraging women to move beyond their "vanilla lifestyles."
Posts: 1901 | Registered: Mar 2007
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quote: invariably start out with, "I normally don't read, but I love this....."
I can't find a reference for it, but I have heard it said: "If you entertain evil, soon evil will entertain you."
Posts: 305 | Registered: Apr 2009
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quote: This new "Fifty Shades of Gray" phenomenon is just one of the latest examples of how that's happening. One of the reasons the book became so popular is because it was first available on the Kindle, so woman could read it without others being able so see the cover. ------------------------- I disagree. Women have been reading steamy books for years and they haven't cared what the covers revealed about their reading choices. The 'romance' genre was pretty steamy 30 years ago - it is probably much more explicit now. My understanding is that genre is one of the best selling. Women probably first read this series on kindle because it was cheap - others probably read it because it was highly reviewed or word of mouth.
A number of women on the thread about the fake covers said they liked Kindle/nook so that others wouldn't see what they are reading and suggested it for others wanting to read 50 shades.
Posts: 4947 | Registered: Sep 2002
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And those books--ugh. It was all some of my neighbors could talk about for weeks. One friend missed out on most of these discussions, asked what they were talking about, and I piped up, "It's porn". Ooh, that raised some hackles. "Oh, not really," someone said. Yet when confronted with the main theme of these books, I got a reluctant, "Well, yeah." And even with that, because it was (literally) all these women were talking about, I was tempted to ask to borrow them. I'm happy to say I resisted, and those who had it have moved. I reminded myself of the Thirteeth A of F, and it helped me get my head back where it belonged.
There are female therapists who say women reading these books are a good thing--they can throw off the shackles women have and branch out and discover new things. The books do raise heart rates and curious questions, but where are the thoughts about mutual love and respect for a partner? Oh, what a quaint idea. Is this part of what the late Senator Moynihan referred to as "defining deviancy down"?
Posts: 3862 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote: A number of women on the thread about the fake covers said they liked Kindle/nook so that others wouldn't see what they are reading and suggested it for others wanting to read 50 shades.
Sad. I think I've read that is why there has been such an explosive growth in pornography - people can view in the privacy of their home and no one has to know.
quote: I had just finished reading two books by Lt.Col. Dave Grossman. Grossman had been a paratrooper and an Army Ranger. He had taught psychology at West Point. In "On Killing," Grossman described how militaries condition soldiers to overcome their aversion to killing. He described how our modern culture, particularly the media, uses those same methods to overcome our aversion to violent entertainment. In "Stop Teaching Our Kids to Kill," Grossman condemned violent video games and issued a call to action for parents, teachers, and religious leaders to also condemn video games.
quote: Evidence of a powerful resistance to killing has popped up in unexpected places. Many people assume that soldiers in a firefight instinctively respond to enemy fire by shooting back, and that soldiers in a kill-or-be-killed situation will choose to kill. But informal interviews conducted with thousands of American combat soldiers during World War II by army historian S.L.A. Marshall revealed that as many as 75% of soldiers never fired their weapons during combat. In recent years the rigor of Marshall’s research methods has been called into question, but his basic conclusion that the majority of soldiers will not return fire during combat if left to their own devices has been corroborated by evidence and accounts from other wars, including the American Civil War, World War I, and the Falklands War.
So why didn’t these soldiers use their weapons? Lt. Col. Dave Grossman, a psychologist and professor of military science, looked at this evidence and concluded “that there is within most men an intense resistance to killing their fellow man. A resistance so strong that, in many circumstances, soldiers on the battlefield will die before they can overcome it.”
...............
Throughout history and around the world people have come up with ways to overcome an aversion to killing, such as dehumanizing the victim, placing distance between the killer and the victim, and using drugs or loud music to induce a trance-like state in a killer. In fact, following publication of Marshall’s findings in the aftermath of World War II, the U.S. military embarked on a campaign to more effectively prepare soldiers for combat by employing realistic training exercises. New recruits began to practice shooting at pop-up, human-shaped targets rather than the traditional, stationary bull’s-eyes. More and more elaborate and realistic combat simulation exercises and ’war games’ were implemented. The point of this new training was to make killing an automatic response under combat conditions. And it worked. Interviews with American soldiers during the Vietnam War revealed that somewhere between 80 and 100 percent of soldiers shot at enemies during firefights.
If the change from a traditional target to a human shaped target had such an effect in soldiers being able to shoot at the enemy, one has to wonder what the general use of these games has on the psyche. Didn't one of the branches in the military release a military based video game recently to entice recruits?
Posts: 5046 | Registered: Aug 2002
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quote: There are female therapists who say women reading these books are a good thing--they can throw off the shackles women have
What Crowgirl said.
Once I started paying attention to social changes that made it more culturally acceptable for women to be involved in porn (because of the aforementioned fireside) I noticed this particular argument showing up again and again. In my opinion, calls for women to "embrace their sexuality" is one of the most significant tools the adversary is using right now.
Posts: 1901 | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
The shackles I was referring to (wow, I had a pun going and didn't realize it) are the societal ones--things that we as women have been told are not things "nice" women do because men were trying to keep us down. Ugh. And again, what kind of love and respect is shown in objectification of this sort? Does it make you a better person?
Posts: 3862 | Registered: Jul 2001
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@palmon -- Yes, the Army did. The game was an unexpected hit. I haven't ever liked the "shooter" game style, so I never followed it, but my quick google search revealed it's now in its 3rd iteration. From what little I recall when it 1st came out, it focused on trying to show a day in the life of a soldier, not necessarily focusing just on the combat, and that when in combat it wasn't endless waves of enemies like in the more "traditional" shooter-style games.
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Sometimes I wonder why I wanted to bring children into this world at all, and what kind of world we'll be leaving behind for them.
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