posted
When you go to a gym or anywhere that requires a change of clothes and there is no area to change that is not in the presence of other men and you are wearing the garments?
I am not new to wearing the garment but I am new to going to the gym and I am not sure what to do about this.
I hope this question is not out of line here and if it is please delete it and forgive me.
Thanks for any help you can offer! Tim
Posts: 406 | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
Well I'm not a man but women do the same thing in locker rooms. I always just find a toilet stall in which to change.
Posts: 8589 | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Personally, I would avoid changing in a toilet stall. I'd be afraid that something had been spilled on the floor.
I would just go ahead and change in front of the guys like everyone else. Chances are you're going to see a lot of different styles of underwear and nobody's going to pay much attention to yours. They're not that interested. Even if they are, they're not going to admit it by commenting about it. It's not macho to notice another guy's underwear.
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dillfest
unregistered
posted
I second Jacare. I just don't worry about it. I don't flaunt anything, but it's not a big deal. They're probably more afraid of you than you are of them
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quote:I would avoid changing in a toilet stall. I'd be afraid that something had been spilled on the floor.
I understand what you mean, but it is doable. It is possible to stand on one foot and maintain balance and arrange things so that your clothing doesn't contact the floor. I don't know about men's bathrooms, but in the women's bathrooms, there are hooks on which you can hang your purse, clothes, etc
Posts: 8589 | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Men's garment bottoms really aren't all that odd from "normal" garment bottoms. And it's quite possible to remove the top WITH the t-shirt you have on (all in one fell swoop.) And even if not, lots of guys wear undershirts. So, for a man, I think it would be a really big non-issue.
Posts: 3274 | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
I just turn my back. If the other women are polite, they're doing the same thing, anyway. It's not like people are staring at your underwear at the gym! And men have an advantage over women, their underwear looks more "normal" (although maybe a little boring, same thing every day! ) If you just turn your back and fold up the garments when you take them off, how is anyone going to know what you're wearing?
Posts: 8155 | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
I learned from several men that I should change at home, and then go. I even heard that the first time I went through the Temple.
The white top is no problem, and the bottom can be removed at the same time as the pants. My only concern is that no one should see the marks on my garments. Not that I'm embarrassed, it's a protection of the hollness of the garment.
Posts: 118 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
I guess I shouldn't derail with "One piece are the only true style..."
One thing you should be prepared with are good answers if asked about it. Perhaps you are nervous about it because you don't know what to say. It could be a good missionary opportunity for you. Boyd K Packer in his book "The Holy Temple" has a great explaination:
quote: On one occasion, one of the brethren was invited to speak to the faculty and staff of the Navy Chaplains Training School in Newport, Rhode Island. The audience included a number of high-ranking naval chaplains from the Catholic, Protestant and Jewish faiths.
In the question-and-answer period one of the chaplains asked, "Can you tell us something about the special underwear that some Mormon servicemen wear?" The implication was, "Why do you do that? Isn't it strange? Doesn't that present a problem?"
To the chaplain who made the inquiry he responded with a question: "Which church do you represent?" In response he named one of the Protestant churches.
He said, "In civilian life and also when conducting the meeting in the military service you wear clerical clothing, do you not?" The chaplain said that he did.
He continued, "I would suppose that that has some importance to you, that in a sense it sets you apart from the rest of your congregation. It is your uniform, as it were, of the ministry. Also, I suppose it may have a much more important place. It reminds you of who you are and what your obligations and covenants are. It is a continual reminder that you are a member of the clergy, that you regard yourself as a servant of the Lord, and that you are responsible to live in such a way as to be worthy of your ordination."
He told them, "You should be able to understand at least one of our reasons why Latter-day Saints have a deep spiritual commitment concerning the garment. A major difference between your churches and ours is that we do not have a professional clergy, as you do. The congregations are all presided over by local leaders. They are men called from all walks of life. Yet they are ordained to the priesthood. They are set apart to presiding positions as presidents, counselors, and leaders in various categories. The women, too, share in that responsibility and in those obligations. The man who heads our congregation on Sunday as the bishop may go to work on Monday as a postal clerk, as an office worker, a farmer, a doctor; or he may be an air force pilot or naval officer. By our standard he is as much an ordained minister as you are by your standard. He is recognized as such by most governments. We draw something of the same benefits from this special clothing as you would draw from your clerical vestments. The difference is that we wear ours under our clothing instead of outside, for we are employed in various occupations in addition to our service in the Church. These sacred things we do not wish to parade before the world."
He then explained that there are some deeper spiritual meanings as well, connecting the practice of wearing this garment with the covenants made in the temple ... The garment, covering the body, is a visual and tactile reminder of these covenants. For many Church members the garment has formed a barrier of protection when the wearer has been faced with temptation. Among other things, it symbolizes our deep respect for the laws of God - among them the moral standard.
It is a great book everyone should pick up if they get the chance. It has helped me know what things you can talk about outside the temple and what things you shouldn't.
posted
I change in the gym, and afterwards, I remove my Garments with my gym clothing, and put on clean ones after my shower, on occasions when the gym is busy, I will change in a toilet stall too, I take care not to allow the Garments to come into contact with the floor, but I do that anywhere, whether it is my own bathroom at home when I take a bath, whether it is in my bedroom or in the gym changing room.
It is easy to be discreet with Garments, I was no less discreet is ordinary underwear, as I have never been comfortable with standing naked in a public place, even if it is merely the shower at the gym.
At the end of the day you will do what is best for you, but I doubt very much anyone in the changing room is going to be staring at your underwear, I think we still attach too much emphasis on the idea that EVERYONE will find Garments something to talk about, stare at or ridicule, personally I think it is one's own attitude that instils this.
Posts: 4584 | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
I am not so much worried about what anyone thinks. I just want to do the right thing.
Changing at home is fine and I have done that when going to the doctor, which is what I was told to do when I first went to the Temple back in 1994. That requires that I not wear the garment at all that day though but that seems ok since I only do that once or twice a year. For me to change at home when I plan to go to the gym would also require I not wear the garment all that day and I need to go to the gym once or twice a week, or so says the doctor.
I have never care much for changing clothes in public places either and this only makes it more difficult. I guess not enough men are bothered by changing before others for there to be any pressure to gave a private changing area. I tried changing in a stall but in the gym I was yesterday there was not even a hook on the wall.
Anyway I am not sure what to do but I need to resolve this someway. Thanks for the input so far and anymore will be appreciated.
To those who say change at home, is that what you do? And do you just not wear the garment at all that day or is home close enough that you can go home and change before going to the gym?
posted
That's a good question, and I wonder what professional athletes who are LDS do. I suppose they just change in front of the others. I'm sure Steve Young was asked about it, or even razzed about it during his playing days. The same with Danny Ainge and Dale Murphy. I don't think it's any different than some of the "strange" clothing that traditional Jews wear, except for the fact that garments are actually commanded of God. So people are for the most part used to some unusual clothing, especially these days.
Posts: 3196 | Registered: May 2006
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posted
My husband got asked about his "secret underwear" at work the other day. After clearing up that it's no more secret than anyone else's underwear, although it is sacred to us, he dropped in the famous, "I'll be happy to discuss my underwear when we can discuss yours, too." That always shuts 'em up.
Posts: 8155 | Registered: Aug 2004
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quote:To those who say change at home, is that what you do? And do you just not wear the garment at all that day or is home close enough that you can go home and change before going to the gym?
The most common time for me to not wear my garments is when I go running. I run in my neighborhood, so it is easy to change at home. Back when I used to play ball, I would change at home and then go. I had time to come home and make the change. On the occasions that I could not, I just changed in the locker room and didn't worry about it. Nobody has ever said anything to me.
Posts: 2011 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Elder Russell M Nelson, in General Conference April 2001 stated the following:
(I have added the bold for emphasis)
quote: In a letter dated 10 October 1988, the First Presidency wrote: "Practices frequently observed among the members of the Church suggest that some members do not fully understand the covenant they make in the temple to wear the garment in accordance with the spirit of the holy endowment.
Church members who have been clothed with the garment in the temple have made a covenant to wear it throughout their lives. This has been interpreted to mean that it is worn as underclothing both day and night. … The promise of protection and blessings is conditioned upon worthiness and faithfulness in keeping the covenant.
The fundamental principle ought to be to wear the garment and not to find occasions to remove it. Thus, members should not remove either all or part of the garment to work in the yard or to lounge around the home in swimwear or immodest clothing. Nor should they remove it to participate in recreational activities that can reasonably be done with the garment worn properly beneath regular clothing. When the garment must be removed, such as for swimming, it should be restored as soon as possible.
The principles of modesty and keeping the body appropriately covered are implicit in the covenant and should govern the nature of all clothing worn. Endowed members of the Church wear the garment as a reminder of the sacred covenants they have made with the Lord and also as a protection against temptation and evil. How it is worn is an outward expression of an inward commitment to follow the Savior".
posted
I think that given the choice between allowing my garments to possibly seen by others in the dressing room, and not wearing my garments for a whole day, I'd rather wear them and have them be seen. I would feel very uncomfortable not wearing my garments for a whole day.
I've made covenants to wear them every day, and I've been counseled not to allow them to come into public ridicule. I'd be as discreet as possible, but it would be my choice to wear them and let them be seen if the only other option was to not wear them all day.
Posts: 5841 | Registered: Sep 2005
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posted
My BIL wore his garments in the military in Viet Nam. He was given permission from SLC to dye them green (really) to make it more likely that he'd come home alive. Some were curious and accepted the explanation that it was a sacred garment associated with covenants. He was mocked by a few. But isn't there something in the scriptures about not being ashamed of the Lord? Most people won't ask. A few will ask sincerely and will respect a simple answer. If occasionally you run into someone who is obnoxious enough to make an issue of it, let it slide by. Be who you are - - an example of a Priesthood bearer not ashamed before the world.
posted
I just remember that at 4:31AM on Monday morning, January 17th, 1994, I was very grateful to be wearing my garments, as the contents of my bedroom, including me, were thrown around every direction and I came to know how a milkshake feels when its being made.
(I live 10 miles north of Northridge, California. Experiencing a 6.7 earthquake (so they said; I think it was a lot stronger than that!) so close to the epicenter was a real thrill!)
posted
When I had my physical for my mission, the (female) MD told me, "You aren't a true Mormon". I said what do you mean and then she told me that true Mormons wear the special clothing. I can't recall how I replied, I think I said I hadn't been to the temple yet and that is why I was prepapring for the mission.
But I appreciated her statement though I know there are many "true Mormons" who just have not yet been to the temple. Since that experience though, I just make sure to not where garments to an MD. Not that I go to the doctor often. (Shame on me, I haven't gone since 1999 even though I have full health insurance, etc. I will go though!!)
quote: My BIL wore his garments in the military in Viet Nam. He was given permission from SLC to dye them green (really) to make it more likely that he'd come home alive
The church makes them special for the military now. Special styles and colors to conform to MIL specs.
BTW: This discussion is pretty funny from a Utah perspective. Here you are looked at funny in a locker room if you DON'T have garments. We Utahns are so judgemental...
posted
Trooper wears the military garments when working with the Reserves, and wore them all the time when he was active duty and in uniform. He only ever had a few comments here and there about them. He got a lot more grief about not drinking/smoking than about his garments.
He is required to wear a blue t shirt under his state patrol uniform, and wears blue shirts that we sent to Church Distribution to have the markings sewn in, so he wouldn't have to wear 3 shirts. (garment top, blue t shirt, uniform top.) It helps tremenously when the temps are reaching the 100s.
I wear my garments to the doctors. Some of my doctors are LDS, and some aren't. But, during a routine exam you either have nothing on (garments folded on a table unseen), or you are just allowing them to lift your shirt enough to get a heart beat and probe a bit. Can't see any markings or anything. It never occured to me NOT to wear them to the doctor.
quote:He is required to wear a blue t shirt under his state patrol uniform, and wears blue shirts that we sent to Church Distribution to have the markings sewn in,
I didn't know you could do that! Cool.
Reminds me of a story of a military brother in my ward: somehow his laundry got mixed up with the other guys', and he was out playing basketball with the other guys when he noticed one of them wearing his green garment top. He told the guy, "I think you got my t-shirts." The guy said he wondered about that, and then commented that he'd been trying to figure out how this brother had managed to rip (and mend) ALL his t-shirts in the same places. Posts: 5841 | Registered: Sep 2005
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posted
Right after my mission I was hired at a job (summer only, I was going to college) that required me to get a physical. The MD was not LDS. When he tried to lift my undershirt, he couldn't (it was an old one-piece garment; they hadn't come out with the two-piece variety yet). I lowered the upper portion and he made some comment that he "didn't know they still made union suits!" Posts: 3371 | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
"When I had my physical for my mission, the (female) MD told me, "You aren't a true Mormon". I said what do you mean and then she told me that true Mormons wear the special clothing. I can't recall how I replied, I think I said I hadn't been to the temple yet and that is why I was prepapring for the mission."
Maybe the doc was joking? A doctor whose practice includes giving exams to missionary candidates would know that young people who haven't served a mission are very often not endowed yet.
I don't go to a gym (although I ought to ), but like Trooperswife, I handle doc visits the way she describes. Doctor's offices are easier because they put you in the exam room with a gown, & give you a few minutes alone to undress & then get dressed later. I've also forgotten what it's like to be without garments for a whole day, & I don't think I want to know Posts: 12901 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
I am not looking for reasons to not wear the garment. I love wearing it but I was told by a member of the Temple presidency when my wife and I were endowed not to wear it to the doctor so that is what I have done. Going home first and changing before I go to the gym is not a practical option as the distance is great. Swimming is the activity I change for, everything else I dress is such a way as the garment is covered. So here is how I see my options.
I can not wear it the days I go to the gym to swim. I dont like that idea.
I can try changing in a stall and have done that but at one gym there is not even a hook on the wall. I dont care for that idea either.
I can just change in the locker area like everyone else and not worry about it. I personally dont like doing that either no matter what kind of underwear I have on but such is the culture. I dont however worry about anyone asking about the garment, I believe in wearing it and am capable of giving an answer as to why.
What I want to do though is the right thing in this, no matter what my personal preference might be.
posted
Not to be too personal, but if you're changing ALL your clothes, couldn't you take off your shirt and garment top at the same time? And same for your pants and garment bottoms? Then they would be kept out of sight.
I really would not worry too much since mens' garments look so much like boxers and a t-shirt. I understand not liking to get dressed in front of others, but that's another issue in itself. I would definitely not skip wearing them just to avoid them possibly being seen.
And keep in mind that the instructions given in the temple to keep them from being subject to public ridicule - while important - are not as binding on us as the covenants we make to wear them every day.
Posts: 5841 | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote: is not even a hook on the wall. I dont care for that idea either.
That's fine not liking this idea, I definitely respect that sentiment. But one idea, is you can buy your own "hook"- they sell plastic over the door hooks that you can get to put over the door.
Posts: 8589 | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
I'm with Trooperswife... I wear my garment to the doctor's office and change into a gown during the few minutes when alone before doc comes in... folding my garments and placing between my clothes... If just a quick visit, I keep my garments on and simply lift my blouse so they can take heartbeat, etc...I simply say, "Oh, I'm wearing my garment" My docs all know I'm LDS... I make sure they do... So they just do their thing and don't say anything about it. My position is they are professionals... I'm LDS...they can just deal with it. I can't even think about not wearing my garment... in the gym, we do have two curtained booths, or I'd use a stall. As last resort, I'd simply turn away and face my locker... I can remove tops and bottoms with clothes, and I wear gym clothes home. I saw Steve Young being interviewed by Mike Wallace along with J.Marriott and another LDS athlete and Mike W. asked about the garments and Steve said he didn't wear his while actually playing because of bleeding, etc., but when dressing after game one of his teammates mentioned they looked "cool" and where could he get some... Steve chuckled and simply told him, "The price is too high." The Garden Girl
Posts: 160 | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:What I want to do though is the right thing in this, no matter what my personal preference might be.
Are you beginning to see there is no "right thing" in this case? The right thing is what is right for you.
Consider: Showering in your socks. People will think you are so weird they won't want to be near you in the locker area and underwear won't be a problem.
Posts: 11629 | Registered: Nov 2000
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quote:Consider: Showering in your socks. People will think you are so weird they won't want to be near you in the locker area and underwear won't be a problem.
And yet like Pink Floyd indicated, it is all individual. For example, they actually sell special "skid proof shower socks" that can be worn in the bath/shower by those individuals who are at risk for falling in the shower.
And I think I have posted way too much in this topic dealing w/men's locker rooms.
Posts: 8589 | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:He is required to wear a blue t shirt under his state patrol uniform, and wears blue shirts that we sent to Church Distribution to have the markings sewn in, so he wouldn't have to wear 3 shirts. (garment top, blue t shirt, uniform top.) It helps tremenously when the temps are reaching the 100s.
That is interesting. I wear my garments under my uniform and t-shirt. I'll have to ask around and see if any of my co-workers do that.
Posts: 2011 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Tim - I have a friend that was in a similar situation. He would stop and the gym on his way home from work to swim. He had problems changing in front of other because of a situation that happened in Jr. High, and there wasn't a seperate changing area at the pool. What he would do is this: before leaving work, he would go into the men's room and change (in the special-needs stall that has more room). He would put his swim trunks on under his pants (instead of his garment bottoms). Then, after swimming, he put his t-shirt back on, wrapped a towel around his waist, and drove home.
I'm lucky enough to have private changing stalls at my gym.
Posts: 207 | Registered: Jun 2006
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quote:I'll have to ask around and see if any of my co-workers do that.
They might, if someone has told them about that service. The shirts just need to be brand new, and you have to send them in at your own expense.
Posts: 4319 | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
Well, here is what I do, and I work out where nearly everyone else in the locker room is LDS as well.
I put the bottoms on, which look sort of like a lot of longer boxers that are out there. Then I put my sweats on on top of that. Then I turn away from anyone else and put the top on (so the markings are not readily apparent). The top looks just like a regular t-shirt from the back. And then I put my shirt on.
I used to not take any precautions at all, until I got "called to repentance" by this old man at the old Deseret Gym for walking down to the scale in my garment bottoms.
I went to BYU, and no one took any precautions there. So I just didn't have that mind set at the time. Posts: 8601 | Registered: Sep 2002
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posted
FWIW, I do not agree with the idea of "change at home," if "change at home" means "change into workout clothes at home and drive to the gym without your garments on."
I think it's more important to wear the garment as much as possible, rather than to worry about what others might see. But that's just my opinion.
I prefer to wear them up until the last possible second. I do most athletic activities in sweats so I can wear my garments.
Posts: 8601 | Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:they actually sell special "skid proof shower socks" that can be worn in the bath/shower by those individuals who are at risk for falling in the shower.
And here I thought they were a good idea to avoid all those nasty fungi out there. Posts: 3274 | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote: And here I thought they were a good idea to avoid all those nasty fungi out there.
A mushroom walks into a bar, sees a good looking girl, asks her if he could buy her a drink, but she declines. Undeterred, he asks, "why not? I'm a fun guy."
(Is there a thread for old jokes?)
[ July 31, 2006, 02:24 PM: Message edited by: Jason ]
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), but like Trooperswife, I handle doc visits the way she describes. Doctor's offices are easier because they put you in the exam room with a gown, & give you a few minutes alone to undress & then get dressed later. I've also forgotten what it's like to be without garments for a whole day, & I don't think I want to know ![[Angst]](graemlins/angst.gif)
