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I'm awake! That is interesting. I agree w/that pastor on how late night activities, late shifts can make one sleepy in church. When I was a direct care giver, there was one year that I worked on the night shift, so yes, there were several times that I would doze in sacrament meeting. Still, I think people should care that people try to get to church despite being tired.
I disagree w/that final sentence that to me implies a decreased love for the Lord if we fall sleepy in church:
quote:Pastor Padfield believes late night entertainment, medications, a lack of interest, or even working a night shift can all make saints fall asleep — regardless of how interesting a sermon might be. "If a person sleeps during periods of 'worship,' those who sit near them need to find out why," he states on his Web site. "Those who sleep during services are a hindrance and detriment to the growth of any congregation. Visitors and our own children can see their lack of commitment to the Lord."
I recently attended a talk by a temple worker. In part of his talk, he spoke in a firm/forceful tone of voice said to try not to fall asleep in the temple. Soemhow the tone of voice had a negative impact on me. He said if you do, you miss a lot. While this person has a point, it bothered me as the focus was a tad more on not falling asleep instead of appreciating that people are there in the first place.
posted
My husband delivered the paper for a while and would fall asleep every Sunday - even when he was sitting on the stand to lead the choir.
I've figured out the problem with falling asleep in the Temple. You rush and worry so much to get there (at least I do), that the adrenaline keeps me awake. Then I sit down in a dark, hushed room, to watch something I've seen many times before, in an atmosphere where all the cares and worries of the world seem to drift away because of the Spirit of peace in the temple - and it turns out that the cares and worries are all that was keeping me awake in the first place. Posts: 5841 | Registered: Sep 2005
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True. You can't hold it against someone when he/she falls asleep. There are so many reasons and we don't have enough info to accurately judge anyone else. It certainly doesn't show a lack of testimony!
On the other hand, sometimes it sure would be help if the speakers would turn up the volumne on the "interesting presentation" knob! Posts: 1911 | Registered: Nov 2004
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I like how you worded that Jenna. I agree w/your reasons and those are exactly what would happen w/me, esp the lights off and the cool room. (Similar when I would fall asleep in the BYU library because it was so frigid. Like I mentionned elsewhere in some other thread, I currently need to regain my temple recommend and not having it has been a major source of stress and shame/angst. So I guess the comment the speaker made and to which I referred didn't seem as encouraging as I wish it had been. I know the person didn't mean harm. Still, it was good food for thought. Well, it is 1:30 AM, Smiley Owl is sending me to bed!
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When I was growing up and my dad was bishop, I noticed him occasionally starting to doze off in the middle of sacrament meeting. That was embarrassing.
Posts: 3511 | Registered: Feb 2005
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My husband, who's blind, had sleep problems for 7 or 8 years. He could only sleep 5 hours a night max and then he was wide awake from 2 or 3 a.m. on. Then, of course, when 2 or 3 in the afternoon rolled around, he was ready to sleep. If he was in church or at the temple or someplace where he was sitting down and it was relatively peaceful, he would be out like the proverbial light. He just would NOT be able to stay awake. He got so much flack from ward members!
We took him to a sleep doctor a couple of years ago; the doctor recommended melatonin (which can be picked up over the counter) and it's worked like a charm. Hubby sleeps 7-8 hours a night or more. Turns out his body wasn't sensing light and dark like it was supposed to, and his levels of melatonin were low ... he's all better now and sleeping in church is down to a minimum.
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no one has yet mentioned the #1 reason people fall asleep in church ------ they are tired of snoring spouses !!!!!!! ....zzzzzzz fg sbjduyfzsd dajflzjmkij dpjajm AS
Posts: 682 | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
I don't think it's a sin either. Of course, if you fall asleep and miss every sacrament meeting, you probably need to do something about it, other than just shrugging and saying, "oh, well." What the guy said about the temple is true, you miss a lot if you fall asleep (actually, that should go without saying). Obviously, our goal should be higher than "be physically present in the temple." Or even "be physically present in church." Everyone falls asleep from time to time, in public, at church, at the temple, at school, etc. But if it's a consistent thing, what is the point? It's like when my 17 month old is going nuts. I can walk with him in the hall for the last two hours of church, or I can go home and put him to bed. I don't think there's some magical benefit from being in the church building, even if I'm not in class, so I just go home. It's the same with sleeping.
Posts: 2993 | Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Anyone who consistently falls asleep at inappropriate times or has problems sleeping at appropriate times needs to see a doctor to find out if they have sleep disorders. There are many, and they can cause more problems than just falling asleep during the day.
For example, obstructive sleep apnea, or OSA, which is when a person stops breathing when they sleep, can have a serious impact on heart health. As a person stops breathing, oxygen levels plummet, and the heart, trying to compensate for lower oxygen levels, speeds up.
Mine goes from 40 to 160 in less than a second during my apneic events, and mine is considered mild. My uncle's, however, is much more severe to the point that the doc told him he'd die of a heart attack in his sleep in 5 to 10 years if he didn't get treatment. Both of us were experiencing narcolepsy (micronaps) because of the sleep deprivation while we were awake, although neither of us were aware of it at the time. Narcolepsy while driving causes accidents.
There are many more sleep disorders than that, however, and they need to be diagnosed and treated with the help of a sleep specialist.
Posts: 4374 | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
I know several people who consistently complain about being tired all the time, yet stay up rather late everynight watching TV or playing on the computer. If someone falls under that category and sleeps during church, then they really should repent, because they are being extremely rude to the brothers and sisters who have spent hours preparing for that service.
[ November 21, 2005, 10:16 PM: Message edited by: Jason ]
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quote:I know several people who consistently complain about being tired all the time, yet stay up rather late everynight watching TV or playing on the computer. If someone falls under that category and sleeps during church, then they really should repent, because they are being extremely rude to the brothers and sisters who have spent hours preparing for that service.
I would agree with that statement some or perhaps most of the time, but not always. Some people have problems with their sleep clock being out of wack or not being able to sleep, and that can also be traced back to sleep disorders.
Last night, I couldn't fall asleep until 4 or 5 am. I did other things instead of tossing and turning in bed. This morning, I have a pounding headache, and if today was church, I probably wouldn't have made it because I feel so ill. But I have nothing to repent of if I did go to church and fell asleep because of this.
If a person makes the choice to stay up late to do other things, and I include bad sleep habits in this, yes. If they stay up late and end up doing other things because they can't sleep properly, then no. Posts: 4374 | Registered: Apr 2003
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And then there are people who, for whatever reason, don't care that church is going to happen the next day because they really don't want to go, so they see no reason not to stay up late watching TV or reading or playing games or whatever, but then the guilt hits them in the morning and they decide they better go to church.
Even in such cases, I think we should lovingly accept them rather than pass judgment on them, for who among us is all set? Who has their life tuned to perfection? We struggle against light and darkness, and sometimes the darkness wins, but we still need to support each other.
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Whenever I fall asleep in church, I miss the best parts. Like this one time when I woke up when there was a THUD from the front of the room and it turned out the poor missionary speaker had passed out! Most exciting thing all year and I missed it. Posts: 562 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
That's what we need in sacrament meeting, we need active songs. Stand up and get the wiggles out or get the sleep monster away.
Posts: 686 | Registered: Jul 2005
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And it isn't only kids, is it? Scientific researchers have said it's best to go to bed around the same time each night, to keep our bodies in rhythym. If we go to bed at 10 or 11 during the week so we can get up for work or school, but stay up till almost dawn on Fri-Sat, it messes up our physiology.
And yet we insist on doing what the docs say not to do, because fun calls out to us louder than keeping our bodies in synch. So why is it surprising that we often put church on a lesser priority than work or school? Parents say, "Get plenty of sleep because tomorrow is a school day." Kids say, "I need a good night's sleep, the big game is tomorrow." Adults say, "I need to get to bed because I have a big [fill in the task or activity] tomorrow."
This doesn't pertain to folks who are on meds, have narcolepsy, work weird hours to feed & clothe themselves & their families, or have other unusual circumstances. It does apply to a lot of us, maybe most of us at some point.
How about if all of us say this Saturday, "Let's get to sleep so we can focus in church. I don't want to miss out on what the speakers say. The sacrament is the highlight of the week & I want to meditate on the atonement instead of nodding off. Maybe if we're wide awake, the hymns will sound like praises to God & not like our vocal chords are struggling to escape from a pit of quicksand."
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quote: That's what we need in sacrament meeting, we need active songs. Stand up and get the wiggles out or get the sleep monster away.
That could be hard in wards where they lock the doors! May be frowned upon. It may be deemed preferable to have the ward clerk go around with a long stick while he is doing the meeting attendance count and poke those dozing off... Posts: 2402 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
I agree with those who said in effect, "why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?"
I know that I don't have a sleep problem, and although I have never fallen completely asleep in a temple session, my head has bobbed a bit. I know that I need to pay more attention to preparing for a session so that I don't "zone out".
I feel that it is not enough to only be there. I am in the Lord's House; he is not only my Father, he is my God. I need to show some respect. Futhermore, I am standing in proxy for an individual who has passed through the veil. I am being a savior on Mount Zion. What kind of savior would I be passed out, snoring through that holy ordinance.
Posts: 228 | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
Maybe I'll try this the next time I am asked to speak.
"...and Joseph Smith was the first prophet in our dispensation...um...sister Johnson, it appears you husband is dozing off. Could you poke him?...as I was saying, Joseph Smith was..."
[ November 22, 2005, 05:47 PM: Message edited by: Jason ]
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posted
Nicole, I worked with a lady who was blind. She was a serious insomniac. I never put the sensing light thing together and neither did she. It makes a ton of sense though.
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Curelom--I really enjoyed what you wrote about the Sacrament of the Lord's Supper being the high point of the week, ot rather the most important event of the week. I am going to try to treat it as such in my life by doing what you recommended--great advice!
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quote:If we go to bed at 10 or 11 during the week so we can get up for work or school, but stay up till almost dawn on Fri-Sat, it messes up our physiology.
People go to bed at 10 or 11??? Wow, that's some feat! Posts: 8170 | Registered: Aug 2004
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quote: Futhermore, I am standing in proxy for an individual who has passed through the veil.
I am very conscious of this when I am ar work in the temple. But boy, once the music begins to play it is like the Sandman is directing all his attention to me, especially if I try to perform two endowment sessions back to back. I feel so disloyal and dismissive to the sister from whom I am the proxy. I know dozing off is an all to human experience, but I feel for myself that I am just as dishonorable as the foolish virgin.
So I do initiatory sessions, LOTS. Cannot fall asleep there. Posts: 5575 | Registered: Jun 2002
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I've never fallen asleep, but I have to work very hard to keep my mind from wandering sometimes. I know that's bad. *hangs head* But I'm just not a visual learner, and it's sometimes hard for me to pay attention to the auditory part when there are so many things going on around me. *sighs* I try my best, though.
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quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If we go to bed at 10 or 11 during the week so we can get up for work or school, but stay up till almost dawn on Fri-Sat, it messes up our physiology.
People go to bed at 10 or 11??? Wow, that's some feat!
I said IF. I didn't say we all DID , at least not all the time.
Many people seem to get very relaxed in the temple. More than once, I've had someone fall on me--or I've had to put my arm out to break someone's fall . Especially in the film presentation, since the lights are out & real people are't moving around they way we see in the live enactment. Every live enactment is a bit different because each individual has his/her own voice & mannerisms. But in the film version, to put it in very superficial termas, if we aren't paying personal attention during the endowment, it's like watching a re-run for the nth time.
I have a couple of things I do to stay focused in the temple. One of my best ones is to do what Nephi said: liken it to myself. In the first part, I put myself into the episodes & anticipate the next thing that will happen or be said. In the second part (when the lights are back on & we're listening more than watching), of course there aren't portrayals, but I try to do the same thing with those proceedings. On the two occasions when there's an unstructured pause in the recording, & we can get up for more than a minute, don't be in a hurry. Stay on your feet & flex your calves, wrists, rib cage, etc for a minute. Our clothing masks those movements so they aren't conspicuous. As long as you're not the last person standing, you won't be the center of attention. Posts: 13018 | Registered: Apr 2005
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You don't have Brother Taps-His-Foot-Incessantly and Sister Shifts-Position-Every-Two-Seconds in your area? (I'm sorry, that's horrible, I know. But really, I get distracted so easily! My movie theater experiences are often not the best, either. Plus, I always have this urge to talk to someone about what's going on. "That is so profound! Isn't that cool?" And of course, I can't. And so my thoughts begin to wander... Often to the brother and sister above mentioned, I'm afraid. )
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Oh, I meant movement by people taking part in the enactment--not the fidgeting that happens all the time. If you've seen a live endowment in Salt Lake or Manti, you know that the people do move around as they fill their roles.
I wasn't talking about Brother Tapfoot or Sister Shifter. They're everywhere. I'm sorry they are such a distraction to you. Now, if you were to just close your eyes for a minute so you're not looking right at them.....heehee
Better yet, if they were to fall asleep & not snore, they'd stop fidgeting & squirming & you could concentrate.
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I learned on my mission that when I go to bed at 10:30 every night I will have very vivid dreams that I remember (Vitamin B6 will also help in that regard). When I don't go to bed regularly, then I won't remember dreaming when I wake up, plus my body is not as well rested.
My state of restedness has more to do with when I go to bed than when I wake up. If I go to bed at midnight, it won't matter how long I sleep-in, I won't be very well rested the next day. If I regularly go to bed at 10:30, then I can get up at 5,6,7 or 8 and be just fine for the entire day.
Posts: 3511 | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Oh, I meant movement by people taking part in the enactment--not the fidgeting that happens all the time. If you've seen a live endowment in Salt Lake or Manti, you know that the people do move around as they fill their roles.
I knew what you meant. I just took that as an opening, there. Posts: 8170 | Registered: Aug 2004
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quote:My state of restedness has more to do with when I go to bed than when I wake up. If I go to bed at midnight, it won't matter how long I sleep-in, I won't be very well rested the next day. If I regularly go to bed at 10:30, then I can get up at 5,6,7 or 8 and be just fine for the entire day.
I'm just the opposite. If I have to get up before about 11 am, I'm gonna be tired all day, whether I went to bed at 8:30 (yes, I did that one day the other week) or at 3:30 (much more common.)
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quote:That's what we need in sacrament meeting, we need active songs. Stand up and get the wiggles out or get the sleep monster away.
As a Ward Music Director, and as an individual with a HUGE passion for music and singing, I would have to say that very few people can sing sitting down, and I am sure that this leads to the abysmal singing heard in most Sacrament Meetings. If we stood up to sing, (a) the singing would be greatly improved, and (b) it would give everyone the chance to stand and stretch and make themselves more alert throughout the meeting.
I try to remain 'alert, attentive and reverent' in the Temple, on two occasions I have struggled to stay awake, and pondered on the reasons for this, as I have not been especially tired when attending the Temple. I concluded that perhaps those whom I was representing at the time had no interest in the ordinance. I mentioned this to a sister in one Temple, who suggested, alternatively, that the ordinance may have already been performed for the particular individual, and therefore they had no interest in my being there in their behalf that day!
quote:Brother Taps-His-Foot-Incessantly and Sister Shifts-Position-Every-Two-Seconds
I'm Brother Shifts-Position-Every-Two-Seconds. I'm afraid my most comfortable sitting position is always one I'm not using at the moment. Sitting up with feet on the floor. Sitting up with right foot resting on left knee. Left foot on right knee. Sitting at an angle with one arm on the back of the pew. Arm around my wife. Holding her hand. Leaning forward with elbows on knees. I've tried them all. And then some.
And some activities just seem to naturally put me to sleep, no matter how well rested I am. Sitting in class. Sitting in meetings. Driving. In the unlikely event <knock on wood> that I'm ever called to serve in the bishopric, my fidgeting and snoring on the stand should at least be worth some entertainment value.
"When I die, I want to go in my sleep, like my grandfather did. Not screaming in terror like the passengers in his car."
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My husband shifts around all the time. He has arthritis in his lower back and he can wiggle, go home, or pass out with pain.
By the way am I the only one who is so flawed that I cannot even see the day when my biggest weakness is falling asleep in church. I didn't even know that should be on my list.
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Nah Grace, it is just an easy one to see and then make fun of.
I feel asleep this past Sunday. But just fior a short time. My wife made fun of me, from several pews away.
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I must say I had a chuckle reading this. I think the only time I fell asleep in Church was because I had had a Missonary dinner the day before and both had just had their suits cleaned.
My mom, who was my roomate, had gone out and because she didn't have a key I laid down to let her back into the house, and proptly broke out in serious hives! Benadryl to the rescue, which made me something of a zombie that day.
More often then not, you'd catch me either taking notes on talks given in Sacrament or writing poems!
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dillfest
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posted
If you took all the people who fall asleep in Church every sunday, and laid them end to end...
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Wow, that's some feat! ![[Big laugh]](graemlins/biglaugh.gif)
, at least not all the time. ![[ROFL]](graemlins/rofl.gif)
. Especially in the film presentation, since the lights are out & real people are't moving around they way we see in the live enactment. Every live enactment is a bit different because each individual has his/her own voice & mannerisms. But in the film version, to put it in very superficial termas, if we aren't paying personal attention during the endowment, it's like watching a re-run for the nth time.![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
